boost creep & dawes device

[strangley brown]

as no one wants my decat pipe i mite as well fit it
i here this may cause boost creep
will fitting a dawes device stop this or is other action required

[E3GSR]

Briggsy had this problem see here http://www.lancer-evo.net/community/...359&highlight=

If you want to know how to do it correctly the first time give Neil a call after 6 ish and he will be able to talk you through it.

Ours hasn't had any problems with boost creep since we put a decat on it (4yrs ago nearly) but every evo is different as we all know.

Hth

T

[strangley brown]

cheers T
i'll put it on and see what happens
got dawes device off woosh
so i'll fit it if i need too
will give neil a call if its not right
if ive read another post right i can fit the decat and
leave it on for the mot

[E3GSR]

No probs Cliff.

As for the MOT it is the luck of the draw with mot stations, some will test it without a cat and some won't.

We just put our cat back on each time, Ours is due for mot mid nov so I will ask the lad who does all our mot's and see what he says, as he is fair and honest.

T

[Karl3]

have had one on mine also for about 9 months with decat uprated down pipe and elbow and never had boost creep..

as said thow some have know too get it..

[Marshallart]

mine used to creep mate, but had the evo 3 turbo fitted and wastegate ported and it cured it.
I have a dawes device if u wanna buy one? I ran 1,2 bar all day with it

[redcup]

Originally Posted by evo1man

As for the MOT it is the luck of the draw with mot stations, some will test it without a cat and some won't.

We just put our cat back on each time, Ours is due for mot mid nov so I will ask the lad who does all our mot's and see what he says, as he is fair and honest.

T

It is not luck of the draw - if your tester says your EVO1,2 or 3 (if first used in Japan before 1st August 1995) needs to meet the emissions standards for a car equipped with a Cat, get them to ring VOSA to confirm.

I had problems with my EVO3 because it was showing on the MOT computer as being 1st Registered 31st December 1995. I showed the MOT man my V5 with the correct date (March 1995) along with Jap Deregistration document and he was able to issue a pass.

Here's some information taken from the IMOC forums (although the specific advice relates to MR2 Turbos, at the time of my last MOT it also held for my EVO3, although I guess they could add the early evos in a later edition of the manual, I think it would be unlikely):

"This is a reply from VOA regarding impoted cars and MOT emissions testing. sticky pease admins!!

“The lack of a catalytic converter is not an automatic fail in itself, but a vehicle may struggle to meet the required emission limits without one. Prior to 31 July 1992, a spark ignition engine is required to meet limits of CO<=3.5% and HC<=1200ppm. Between 1 August 1992 and 31July 1995, the limits will depend on whether or not the vehicle is listed in the current edition of the In Service Exhaust Emission Standards for Road Vehicles book ( currently the Ninth Edition) which all MOT stations are required to hold. If there is an exact match in this book for the vehicle ( regarding engine number/type, model, chassis no, etc. The exact requirements vary between manufacturers) then the vehicle will be tested to the limits in the book. If an exact match cannot be found, the vehicle will again need to meet limits of CO<=3.5% and HC<=1200ppm. I have looked up your particular model and engine and, as stated in your e-mail, this combination is not listed and therefore the vehicle would need to meet limits of CO<=3.5% and HC<=1200ppm. From 1 August 1995, the requirements again depend on whether or not the vehicle is listed in the Emissions book. As your particular combination is not listed, vehicles of this age would need to be tested to the following limits: Minimum oil temperature : 60C Idle (450 - 1500rpm) CO<=4.5% Fast Idle (2500-3000rpm) CO<=0.3% HC<=200ppm Lambda= 0.97 to 1.03 There is one possible exemption to the above requirements. If the customer can provide a letter from the manufacturer, quoting the chassis number and engine number of the vehicle, stating that the engine as originally installed could not meet the relevant UK emissions limits. In this case, the vehicle can be tested to the next lowest limit.” Hope this clears things up...

Emissions testing covers both Diesel and petrol engines.
There are some general considerations:
One important issue must be cleared up straight away. There is no requirement for a catalytic converter to be fitted to any vehicle, regardless of its age. It is however the most popular way of ensuring engines meet the emission legislation. The MOT test is testing the emissions from the tailpipe and if those emissions meet the standard then the vehicle passes. The term 'cat' test is inappropriate, the correct term is 'advanced emission test'. Its not the 'cat' that's being tested. There are a number of vehicles which are subject to the 'advanced emission test' but are capable of meeting the requirements without the use of a catalytic converter.
Kit cars and amateur built vehicles are regarded as pre 1st August 1975 vehicles for the purposes of MOT emissions testing and are subject to a visual check only. The age of the engine is not taken into account. SVA(single vehicle approval) introduces some problems and these are complex, the SVA manual is the source of information. In a nutshell all vehicles get a "visual check" and vehicles first used after 1/8/75 or with an engine manufactured after this date get a metered check or a CAT test if they are listed in the emissions handbook or are on the emissions tester database. After August 1995 they get a CAT test. Amateur built vehicle SVA emissions tests are based on the vehicle build date unless there is proof that the engine is earlier. If a date cannot be determined, until 31 March 2001 they will get a non CAT test. From the 1st April 2001 the effective date will be assumed to be 1st August 1997, i.e they will get a CAT test unless there is proof of the date of manufacture of the engine. Also, dual fuel (petrol/gas) are tested in both modes.
Personal imports are tested according to date of first use. To claim exemption, a letter from the vehicle manufacturer must be produced at the time of test.
Modified engines must still meet the requirements.
An older engine fitted to a vehicle will be tested to the age of the engine (evidence needed). A newer engine fitted to an older car will be tested to the age of the car i.e whichever is the oldest.
Vehicles which are not passenger cars are tested to different emissions limits in most cases. A passenger car is constructed to carry passengers, has no more than 5 seats excluding the driver, does not exceed 2500kg gross weight and is not a goods vehicle i.e pick-up, van or truck.
It will be necessary for evidence of first used dates to be produced in some cases (personal number plates, 1987's for seat belts and 1992's/94's for emissions) i.e V5 reg document or VE103 for leased/hired vehicles. Some vehicles may have been stored for long periods before being distributed by manufacturers. In these cases, if the vehicle was manufactured at least 6 months before its date of first use then the date of manufacture is used for test requirements.
Engines must be thoroughly warmed up and the oil temperature tested prior to testing (80 degrees C for most "CAT" tests although some are as low as 40 and 80 degrees C for Diesels). It's permissable for the emissions test to be carried out as soon as the vehicle arrives (environmentally friendly too) as long as the rest of the test is carried out on the same day by the same tester.
Any obstructions at the tailpipe which prevent the test probe being inserted will result in failure.
From 1st August 2001 a simplified emissions check was introduced and this will be carried out on vehicles prior to doing a full "CAT" test. If the vehicle meets the requirements during this BETs (basic emission test) then it passes. There will be no need to measure the engine temperature using the analyser probe but the vehicle must be at normal running temperature. However, engine rpm will still be measured. If the vehicle fails the BET then the full "CAT" test is applied.
The BET standards are:
Fast idle 2500-3000rpm
CO no more than 0.3%
HC no more than 200 parts per million
Lambda between 0.97 and 1.03
Normal idle 450-1500rpm
CO no more than 0.5% "

[evo3ben]

There was a big debait over on the other side about the MOT. I ended up ringing VOSA over all this and found that all Jap imports 01/03/1996 or below do not have to go through a cat test. I then went to the mot station and explained this to the tester. He in turn rang VOSA and was told exactly the same thing. My car passed with flying colours with de-cat, fuel mods etc etc :-)

Boost creep is just one of them things. It is enevitable with a cirtain set up that you will get boost creep. The only way to combat this is getting the porting done on the turbo. Either that or buy a monster mach IV turbo housing £150 and put the internals from you turbo into that. I get boost creep. The higher the boost is set the more i get. The main area you get this is in 4th and 5th gear. I climb to 1.2 bar in 4th and 5th gear when boost controller is set to 1 bar. You can alter it abit using an Apexi avcr but unfortunatly not eliminate it.
The dawes divice is good but not ideal. You will need to have a boost gauge to set it up and set it too high and could be nasty. Ideal would be an electronic boost controller for adjustability and safety. For an extra £100 on top of the price of a dawes device its money well spent to be honest to get a good second hand one off ebay ie HKS evcIII evectronic boost controller.

[E3GSR]

Originally Posted by redcup

It is not luck of the draw - if your tester says your EVO1,2 or 3 (if first used in Japan before 1st August 1995) needs to meet the emissions standards for a car equipped with a Cat, get them to ring VOSA to confirm.

I had problems with my EVO3 because it was showing on the MOT computer as being 1st Registered 31st December 1995. I showed the MOT man my V5 with the correct date (March 1995) along with Jap Deregistration document and he was able to issue a pass.

Here's some information taken from the IMOC forums (although the specific advice relates to MR2 Turbos, at the time of my last MOT it also held for my EVO3, although I guess they could add the early evos in a later edition of the manual, I think it would be unlikely):

"This is a reply from VOA regarding impoted cars and MOT emissions testing. sticky pease admins!!

“The lack of a catalytic converter is not an automatic fail in itself, but a vehicle may struggle to meet the required emission limits without one. Prior to 31 July 1992, a spark ignition engine is required to meet limits of CO<=3.5% and HC<=1200ppm. Between 1 August 1992 and 31July 1995, the limits will depend on whether or not the vehicle is listed in the current edition of the In Service Exhaust Emission Standards for Road Vehicles book ( currently the Ninth Edition) which all MOT stations are required to hold. If there is an exact match in this book for the vehicle ( regarding engine number/type, model, chassis no, etc. The exact requirements vary between manufacturers) then the vehicle will be tested to the limits in the book. If an exact match cannot be found, the vehicle will again need to meet limits of CO<=3.5% and HC<=1200ppm. I have looked up your particular model and engine and, as stated in your e-mail, this combination is not listed and therefore the vehicle would need to meet limits of CO<=3.5% and HC<=1200ppm. From 1 August 1995, the requirements again depend on whether or not the vehicle is listed in the Emissions book. As your particular combination is not listed, vehicles of this age would need to be tested to the following limits: Minimum oil temperature : 60C Idle (450 - 1500rpm) CO<=4.5% Fast Idle (2500-3000rpm) CO<=0.3% HC<=200ppm Lambda= 0.97 to 1.03 There is one possible exemption to the above requirements. If the customer can provide a letter from the manufacturer, quoting the chassis number and engine number of the vehicle, stating that the engine as originally installed could not meet the relevant UK emissions limits. In this case, the vehicle can be tested to the next lowest limit.” Hope this clears things up...

Emissions testing covers both Diesel and petrol engines.
There are some general considerations:
One important issue must be cleared up straight away. There is no requirement for a catalytic converter to be fitted to any vehicle, regardless of its age. It is however the most popular way of ensuring engines meet the emission legislation. The MOT test is testing the emissions from the tailpipe and if those emissions meet the standard then the vehicle passes. The term 'cat' test is inappropriate, the correct term is 'advanced emission test'. Its not the 'cat' that's being tested. There are a number of vehicles which are subject to the 'advanced emission test' but are capable of meeting the requirements without the use of a catalytic converter.
Kit cars and amateur built vehicles are regarded as pre 1st August 1975 vehicles for the purposes of MOT emissions testing and are subject to a visual check only. The age of the engine is not taken into account. SVA(single vehicle approval) introduces some problems and these are complex, the SVA manual is the source of information. In a nutshell all vehicles get a "visual check" and vehicles first used after 1/8/75 or with an engine manufactured after this date get a metered check or a CAT test if they are listed in the emissions handbook or are on the emissions tester database. After August 1995 they get a CAT test. Amateur built vehicle SVA emissions tests are based on the vehicle build date unless there is proof that the engine is earlier. If a date cannot be determined, until 31 March 2001 they will get a non CAT test. From the 1st April 2001 the effective date will be assumed to be 1st August 1997, i.e they will get a CAT test unless there is proof of the date of manufacture of the engine. Also, dual fuel (petrol/gas) are tested in both modes.
Personal imports are tested according to date of first use. To claim exemption, a letter from the vehicle manufacturer must be produced at the time of test.
Modified engines must still meet the requirements.
An older engine fitted to a vehicle will be tested to the age of the engine (evidence needed). A newer engine fitted to an older car will be tested to the age of the car i.e whichever is the oldest.
Vehicles which are not passenger cars are tested to different emissions limits in most cases. A passenger car is constructed to carry passengers, has no more than 5 seats excluding the driver, does not exceed 2500kg gross weight and is not a goods vehicle i.e pick-up, van or truck.
It will be necessary for evidence of first used dates to be produced in some cases (personal number plates, 1987's for seat belts and 1992's/94's for emissions) i.e V5 reg document or VE103 for leased/hired vehicles. Some vehicles may have been stored for long periods before being distributed by manufacturers. In these cases, if the vehicle was manufactured at least 6 months before its date of first use then the date of manufacture is used for test requirements.
Engines must be thoroughly warmed up and the oil temperature tested prior to testing (80 degrees C for most "CAT" tests although some are as low as 40 and 80 degrees C for Diesels). It's permissable for the emissions test to be carried out as soon as the vehicle arrives (environmentally friendly too) as long as the rest of the test is carried out on the same day by the same tester.
Any obstructions at the tailpipe which prevent the test probe being inserted will result in failure.
From 1st August 2001 a simplified emissions check was introduced and this will be carried out on vehicles prior to doing a full "CAT" test. If the vehicle meets the requirements during this BETs (basic emission test) then it passes. There will be no need to measure the engine temperature using the analyser probe but the vehicle must be at normal running temperature. However, engine rpm will still be measured. If the vehicle fails the BET then the full "CAT" test is applied.
The BET standards are:
Fast idle 2500-3000rpm
CO no more than 0.3%
HC no more than 200 parts per million
Lambda between 0.97 and 1.03
Normal idle 450-1500rpm
CO no more than 0.5% "

You need to come to Wrexham and advise all the mot stations around here.

It's a grey area with moting imports the same as some stations will fail you for your number plate and some don't care.

[j30l]

this is what i found out about having cats and not having cats for the mot's